How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

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IH_Guys
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:22 pm

How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by IH_Guys »

I am trying to sell my '97 40' Continental, and as I was getting it all in shape to show of course something broke. The 18" Thin_Lite in the bedroom was cycling on and off, but eventually stayed on, until 3 days ago - it quit working completely. So, I ordered 6 new tubes from Amazon figuring all three of the18" fixtures should be the same. New tubes didn't help, it was the ballast that was bad - $35 or buy a new fixture for $48. Well this was the "Good reason" I was looking for to convert at least one of these to LED. In 2016 I bought 3 rolls of these light strips ( https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01A7 ... UTF8&psc=1 ) to convert the 120 V light in the Kitchen - used them for my house pantry remodel, they worked great. Still 2 rolls left. Used another for my office remodel - was again pleased with results. One roll left and a new project. Good news, they are still available and improved, bad news the price went from $22 per 16' roll to $35 per roll.
Took a few hours, only because I soldered the + and - terminals together on one strip, and then mixed up the Power wire polarities. End results was great - used 4 18" strips, doubled the light output and cut the power by almost 50%. Could have kept the light output the same by only using 2 18" strips (3 watts per foot) and cut the power down to 9 watts from 30.

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astrnmrtom
Posts: 167
Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:49 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by astrnmrtom »

I did the same a couple years ago and really liked the results. As you said, more light, less power, and no tubes or ballasts to worry about. In addition to the change to three white LED strips, I added a small toggle switch to the other end and added a single red strip in the middle of each lamp. I'm an amateur astronomer and I can flip the little toggle change all my interior lights to red to preserve night vision when going in and out of the rig while viewing. Not sure any future owner will appreciate the additional feature but it works great for me!
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Tom and Pris Masterson, w/ Buddy the 18 year old Siamese cat.
1998 Serengeti 3706
300hp Cat 3126, Allison 3060
900 Watts of Solar
17cf, Fisher & Paykel residential Refrigerator
Dragging four telescopes around the US seeking dark skies.
TDJohn
Posts: 552
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:34 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by TDJohn »

Tom,

Would deep amber or orange preserve night vision, or is it just red that works?
John
'95 Serengeti, Cummins C8.3-300
Allison 6spd.
astrnmrtom
Posts: 167
Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:49 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by astrnmrtom »

Deep amber or orange would work but it would have to be dimmer, possibly much dimmer. The dark adapted eye is less sensitive to longer wavelengths which is why red is used. Orange is shorter than red, and amber shorter still.

One mistake people make with regards to using red light for dark adaptation, is they think you can throw a red lens over a bright flashlight and you're good to go. Even red lights can be too bright. It takes about a half hour for the eye to dark adapt and it continues to get more sensitive for over an hour. I've experienced increased sensitivity over a period of several hours on long nights of observing under very dark skies. A fully dark adapted eye is around 1,000,000 times more sensitive to light that in full sunlight. If you expose your dark adapted eye to even a brief bright light, the process starts over. That's why if you with a group of amateur astronomers and you accidently turn on your headlight everyone gets very angry and might pelt you with rocks. :evil:

Flashlights designed to be used when stargazing have variable brightness and when you are trying to see an object in the telescope that is at the very limits of you vision, you must be careful even with a dim red light. When I'm really pushing the limit, and I need to consult a chart, I'll turn on the flashlight until I can barely read the chart. Once I was at a hilltop astronomy conference and in the middle of the night another observer come over to scold me about the little green power LED on my telescope motor controller. She and a friend were observing about 10 feet away and she said the light was too bright - plus who puts a green LED on a telescope meant to be used in the dark anyway!? I took a black sharpie to the head of the LED and all was well with the world again. :oops: Even the starlight on a dark night can cause problems when trying to see the faintest of object. Throwing a dark hood over your head can get you seeing a little tiny bit deeper.

When red LED flashlights first hit the market they were a boon because they emit a fairly narrow set of wavelengths. A red filter over a white light is mostly red but transmits other wavelengths albeit in less amounts. In a pinch, a layer or two from a brown paper bag can do as long as the light isn't too bright.
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Tom and Pris Masterson, w/ Buddy the 18 year old Siamese cat.
1998 Serengeti 3706
300hp Cat 3126, Allison 3060
900 Watts of Solar
17cf, Fisher & Paykel residential Refrigerator
Dragging four telescopes around the US seeking dark skies.
TDJohn
Posts: 552
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:34 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by TDJohn »

Very interesting, and informative. The reason I ask is my eyes don't like red light only type of light, when it is dark, like your RV would be with the red light on. In makes my eyes go wacky and feel weird.

BTW, speaking of red lights. If you want to easily catch night crawlers for fishing, use a red light, the don't react to it, so you can catch a bunch of worms pretty quickly. If night crawlers see white light, they quickly squirm into the ground.

Thanks for the input.
John
'95 Serengeti, Cummins C8.3-300
Allison 6spd.
stuplich@ymail.com
Posts: 1146
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:51 am

Red lights (was: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED)

Post by stuplich@ymail.com »

TDJohn wrote: Sun Mar 08, 2020 6:52 pm Very interesting, and informative. The reason I ask is my eyes don't like red light only type of light, when it is dark, like your RV would be with the red light on. In makes my eyes go wacky and feel weird.
BTW, speaking of red lights. If you want to easily catch night crawlers for fishing, use a red light, the don't react to it, so you can catch a bunch of worms pretty quickly. If night crawlers see white light, they quickly squirm into the ground.
Thanks for the input.
TDJohn
The dash gauges/instruments in my 1947 Ercoupe where illuminated red for night flights:
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/e0/1e/e1 ... 876a67.jpg
Mel
'96 Sahara 3530, mine since '01
250 hp 3126 Cat, MD3060 Allison
TDJohn
Posts: 552
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:34 pm

Re: Red lights (was: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED)

Post by TDJohn »

stuplich@ymail.com wrote: Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:41 pm
TDJohn wrote: Sun Mar 08, 2020 6:52 pm Very interesting, and informative. The reason I ask is my eyes don't like red light only type of light, when it is dark, like your RV would be with the red light on. In makes my eyes go wacky and feel weird.
BTW, speaking of red lights. If you want to easily catch night crawlers for fishing, use a red light, the don't react to it, so you can catch a bunch of worms pretty quickly. If night crawlers see white light, they quickly squirm into the ground.
Thanks for the input.
TDJohn
The dash gauges/instruments in my 1947 Ercoupe where illuminated red for night flights:
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/e0/1e/e1 ... 876a67.jpg
8-)
John
'95 Serengeti, Cummins C8.3-300
Allison 6spd.
Moonwink
Posts: 50
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:46 pm
Location: Near St Louis, MO

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by Moonwink »

Here's what I used to convert my ThinLites - Just over $4 a pack - one pack will replace the lights in one 12" fixture and produce more light than the original tubes. The light is equivalent to cool white. I just cut the wires to ballast leaving it in place and spliced in the wires from the lights. They are polarity sensitive so you might need to reverse the leads if they don't light. I replaced all my tubes about 3 years ago and have few problems since.

6 pieces for $12.69
https://www.amazon.com/Universal-Waterp ... 07WMRTZJM/

You can find them cheaper on eBay. At these prices buy a few extra in case some don't preform perfectly. Maybe put a couple on the front of your vehicle to be seen easily.

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Last edited by Moonwink on Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Don Ford
2004 Safari Trek 31SBD (F53/V10 20,500GVW)
'15 Malibu 2LT or '97 Aerostar MiniVan (Remco driveshaft disconnect) for Towed vehicles
BlueOx Aventa II Towbar - ReadyBrake Inertia Brake System
astrnmrtom
Posts: 167
Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:49 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by astrnmrtom »

John,

I understand your issue with red light. I've been using them since I was a kid so I'm used to how things look. I have found that as I have aged, it's harder to read my charts under red lights. Our eyes are optimized for the yellow/green wavelengths and can have more trouble focusing colors the farther away you get from those wavelengths. You can really notice it with deep blue or purple lights.Even notice how blurry the tubes look in a black light? Plus red light makes familiar objects look much different because of the way it is reflected or absorbed by different colors making odd contrasts. I suspect it could be at least a little disorienting for most people trying to navigate by any single colored light.

As for converting RV lights to LED, I've been experimenting with various LEDs since they first started showing up on the market. Tried a lot of different types trying to find ones that were bright enough. The technology has really matured and we have lots of choices. One type I tried a few years ago was smaller COB boards that while bright enough got so hot that the solder on the leads would melt and they would fail. I even tried mounting them tight to the metal fixtures to act as a heat sink but the boards the chips were mounted too weren't designed to transfer the heat. The newer ones like ones shown above are much better. Previous RVs I owned took the 1156 bulbs and with those it was easy to pop out the old bulb and put in a LED. Used to keep a bag full of red LEDs for my astronomy trips.
Tom and Pris Masterson, w/ Buddy the 18 year old Siamese cat.
1998 Serengeti 3706
300hp Cat 3126, Allison 3060
900 Watts of Solar
17cf, Fisher & Paykel residential Refrigerator
Dragging four telescopes around the US seeking dark skies.
TDJohn
Posts: 552
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:34 pm

Re: How to make a Thin-Lite into an LED

Post by TDJohn »

astrnmrtom wrote: Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:31 pm John,

I understand your issue with red light. I've been using them since I was a kid so I'm used to how things look. I have found that as I have aged, it's harder to read my charts under red lights. Our eyes are optimized for the yellow/green wavelengths and can have more trouble focusing colors the farther away you get from those wavelengths. You can really notice it with deep blue or purple lights.Even notice how blurry the tubes look in a black light? Plus red light makes familiar objects look much different because of the way it is reflected or absorbed by different colors making odd contrasts. I suspect it could be at least a little disorienting for most people trying to navigate by any single colored light.

As for converting RV lights to LED, I've been experimenting with various LEDs since they first started showing up on the market. Tried a lot of different types trying to find ones that were bright enough. The technology has really matured and we have lots of choices. One type I tried a few years ago was smaller COB boards that while bright enough got so hot that the solder on the leads would melt and they would fail. I even tried mounting them tight to the metal fixtures to act as a heat sink but the boards the chips were mounted too weren't designed to transfer the heat. The newer ones like ones shown above are much better. Previous RVs I owned took the 1156 bulbs and with those it was easy to pop out the old bulb and put in a LED. Used to keep a bag full of red LEDs for my astronomy trips.
The deep blue LED lights, like one often sees on cop cars, really flips my eyes out at night. Some of those lights have gotten so bright, that it is actually dangerous on the road. It makes it very hard to see the road and if there is anyone standing there, when the cop lights are blasting in your eyes. I'm surprised it doesn't trigger seizures for prone people, considering the rapid flashing frequency some of those lights have.
I also find LED lights that are in the 4500K and above very annoying, especially at night. The HID and new LED lights on cars now days are brutal at night. :x
I usually do best in the 2000 to 3000K range, preferably 2200K. It took a while, but now they are finally making LED lights that are below 3000K range. Even though they are power hogs, I still use a few of the old fashion incandescent lights in my coach. :mrgreen:
John
'95 Serengeti, Cummins C8.3-300
Allison 6spd.
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